Saponi….clothing in the 1800's.

Hey jeff; Bill is probably right about the Saponi people dressing like the rest of the population in the 1800’s., that may even apply to the late 1700’s.

But.. at what point did the dress change?, we are not sure, but because dressing in Euro. style clothing was probably fast becoming a status issue, just like todays latest fashion trends we are not sure what they may have identified as traditional clothing.

Much of the tribal culture appears to been kept under the carpet pretty early, however traditions may have been kept alive in areas such as foods medicines, etc things that made daily abstracts into geometerics, as it were.

If you look at the Sara Town woman, and do a seacrh from the NC archaeology archives data bases, things changed pretty quickly.

But… Iam sure that in many of the back areas out of Euro views, people probably tanned hides for foot wear and heavy clothing, maybe tailored like Euro clothes but with aboriginal materials, other items that appear to have been used later were traditional baskets, hunting methods and certainly clearing fields with fires.

Lastly there is the issue of tattoos that has been discussed here a good bit, I maintain that they may have been used up until the mid 1800’s, some of these tribal designs may have found thier way into beadwork and embroidery, especially on womens clothing etc.

If you look at the thread titled “Tom’s Family” you’ll see some of the items mentioned here.

Thanx for the asking! I hope this helps.

The Mississippi Chocatws have retained a type of dress that is uniquely thiers, altho’ there are several other Choctaw groups in the south or near south,the MS people seem to have been a large enough group to keep a status quo.

I would guess that there are other people in small enclaves across the south that have gone on undocumented, that have retained similar clothing styles or unique traditions in thier communities, but with out a detailed study of this by community members we might never know this.

I you folks have pic’s of these traditions being carried on into the 1940’s-50’s please post what you might have.

I have friends in Ga, that have several pieces of clothing that at first glance would look very Euro. but the deigns and appliques are not at all what the larger societies would have been using at the same time.

I can’t help but wish that some where some one will have knowledge of traditional eastern siouan clothing etc., for sure we do know that atleast several families on this web site have had older generations wearing center seam mocccasins, so my question is why not other types of clothing like what my great Grandmothers generation did.?

Red Metis wrote: I have no way to find any of these articles, pictures, etc. from my family. My Dad and grandfather were estranged and as you see, much of this information came from my mother. If she wouldn’t have grown up in the same neighborhood then I’d know even less. I hate this feeling of being cut off my family’s history.

Sorry for the late reply, but I just wanted to let you know that I can certainly sympathize. My paternal grandfather’s family is not exactly the most harmonious bunch on earth–to the point of at least one surname change–and there have been several similar splits that I know of. For that matter, one aunt is not speaking to me now, and nobody else knows why! It’s frustrating. I just try to pick up what I can; it’s all a person can do, really.

Good luck!

ahwikatani;33515 wrote: Does anybody have any record of what the saponi wore pre-contact time?

‘Siyo Ahwi,

There is a thread on here somewhere about that, which refers to a book called, “Encyclopedia of American Indian Costume”. Lotta people won’t like the title, but it is one of few books that include Eastern Siouan.

I have it here, so will give brief overview:

Men wore soft deerskin breechclout…not tanned, but rubbed between hands with really long fingernails. May have worn leggings for travel.

Women wore a wraparound skirt made of cloth made from Spanish moss, mulberry bark (inner), or softened basswood bark. They also wore a shawl, fastened on one shoulder, leaving the right arm uncovered. This book says that the wealthier people wore deerskin. (woulda thought the best hunters would have had the deerskin, but perhaps it was traded?)

They went barefoot, but sometimes wore swamp mocs.

No headgear.

Finger woven girdles made from possum hair. Added to this and woven bark garments were fringes dyed red with puccoon root.

Matchcoats or mantles made of fur or feathers, and sometimes deerskin.

Copper jewelry, beads, loops. (It is said the Tuscarora went west to trade for copper and bring it back.)

They favored body painting over tatoos.

They were quick to adopt tradecloth, esp. blue and red strouding, which replaced materials used for breechclouts and skirts. Then the fellas changed to pants, shirts and coats, while the ladies started wearing long full cotton dresses.

I was also wondering, is there any info on the Saponi wearing turquois(I know the Cherokee were big on it).

My understanding is that turquoise was not something the southeastern tribes would have been wearing much of. Would have to disagree about the Cherokee being big on it…at least, that is not what I’ve been taught. May have traded for it, though.

Thanks again for the info Beeleaf, I am still learning,so all info is important and helpful to me. And thank you also Techteach for your input on this,I do know blue and white are big colors for the Sioux. I want to learn as much as I can about the Saponi culture and their way of life,and all of this info is very helpful to me.Along this note,is there a book with a lot of info on the Saponi tribe available? Does the Saponi tribe practice the same religious culture as the Sioux?

There is no one book. There are some good articles in the Bureau of American Ethnology series, and some other historic/ anthopological series. A good university library should have that. You just have to do the usual hunting through the univerisity’s indexes of their holdings and pour through it all. I had ambitions of compiling it all, but I haven’t. Richard Haithcock compilations have a lot of good stuff.

As for religion . . . we really don’t know. There are a number of theories on just how great the time-separation is between the western Sioux and the Siouan tribes of the East and Midwest. I now believe it’s a good deal less than a millenia, which to me implies a good deal of cultural/religious similarities. A huge conversion movement could of course wipe that out in a few generations. I take inspiration from what I learn of the exisitng Western Sioux thoughts and beliefs and am grateful that so much survives.

There was some record made of VA/NC Siouan reliigious beliefs, the most notable of which was what Ned Bearskin told the people he was guiding through the countryside. I’m a bit skeptical because part of it sounds to me like something he was regaling them with while passing around a jug or two. He could have been pulling their leg. And it all was after the conversion period at Ft Christanna, so it could have been heavily influenced by Christianity. So . . . like I said, we really don’t “know” much in a provable, documentable way.