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I start with William Howard b. 1658 in York Co. VA married to Mary Groves (no info as of yet). Son William Howard b. 1702 married Elizabeth Hillsman. Sons Henry and Groves b.Nov. 05, 1733 with sister Mary. Groves married Hannah Allen b. 1740, married Mar. 7, 1760. They had 14 children one of which was Littleton b. Feb. 18, 1767. (I have a list of the other children). Littleton married Martha “Patsy” Thorp (b. 1770 franklin Co. NC) Jan. 10, 1789 in Granville Co., NC. they had a son named William Howard b. 1789 married Mary William. they had a son named James Howard b. Mar. 1, 1838 in Decatur IA married Lydia Gibler Oct. 8, 1857(b. Jan 10, 1840) her parents were David Gibler and Sarah Margaret Sams. James and Lydia had a son named Asa Howard married to Sarah Smith, daughter of Isaac E. Smith and Catherine Franklin.
Seems as though Groves Howard had signed the petition for taxing the Freedmen at that time
I Would like information about the Mary Groves family. The Elizabeth Hillsman family. The Martha “Patsy” Thorp family. The Mary William family. Sarah Margaret Sams family.
I have found another birth date for William Howard born 1791(?) and he married Mary Moore not William( this was a typo-sorry).
Children of William and Mary married Dec. 31, 1820 are:
James W.
Asa
Nicholas
Alex
Margaret
Elizabeth
George
Samuel
Joe
James W. Howard b. Mar. 1, 1838 in Davis City, Decatur Co., IA married Lydia Gibler b.Jun 10, 1840 in KY/OH? married Oct. 8, 1857. Their children are:
Mary E.
Asa
Edward
Sarah Margaret
Harriet Ann
William D.
John S.
Albert M
Ida Jane
George W
James Alexander
Martha “Patsy” Thorp married Littleton Howard. John Thorp married Martha Howard. Martha is the daughter of Francis Howard and Ann Allen. Littleton is the son of Groves Howard and Hannah Allen. Ann Allen and Hannah Allen are sisters. John Thorp and Martha Thorp are siblings. Parents John Thorp and Sarah Terry. And Groves Howard and Francis Howard are related. Gets rightly confusing! I have no info on Mary Groves. But Howard family in York co Va early. Saj
Hey saj: How close are we in the CUZ world?
That’s some great info. I just don’t have the insight to find this kind of info. You’re sure are a GURU. Thanks, Bob.
Hey Bob, thanks!
Sometimes I get so confused trying to sort people out! The more we find the closer cousins we get to be!!:)
I have a whole sheet on these people which when I get time I’ll find it and post more.
You mentioned Mayes co Ok in your one post. Brown? I just found people there down the line of Drury Allen and Robert Jr. Brothers to my Joseph. Amanda Paralee Allen is listed on Dawes as a parent. They were at the Cherokee School when it closed 1906? Have to look. But she is listed as Choctaw on Dawes. Very exciting! Saj
saj wrote: Martha “Patsy” Thorp married Littleton Howard. John Thorp married Martha Howard. Martha is the daughter of Francis Howard and Ann Allen. Littleton is the son of Groves Howard and Hannah Allen. Ann Allen and Hannah Allen are sisters. John Thorp and Martha Thorp are siblings. Parents John Thorp and Sarah Terry. And Groves Howard and Francis Howard are related. Gets rightly confusing! I have no info on Mary Groves. But Howard family in York co Va early. Saj
saj: would you say this 10 x’s real fast????? hahahaha. Are any of these families recognised as Indian families as of yet? We mustn’t forget the Sams family who moved into the Monogalia Co. area.
You know I have wondered at times about the Choctaws and Chicasaws. My Mom is Chicasaw decended. This is a whole different story. She is from the Hamilton/Bethea, Hamilton/Newland, and Hale/Selby lines along with some others.
saj wrote: Martha “Patsy” Thorp married Littleton Howard. John Thorp married Martha Howard. Martha is the daughter of Francis Howard and Ann Allen. Littleton is the son of Groves Howard and Hannah Allen. Ann Allen and Hannah Allen are sisters. John Thorp and Martha Thorp are siblings. Parents John Thorp and Sarah Terry. And Groves Howard and Francis Howard are related. Gets rightly confusing! I have no info on Mary Groves. But Howard family in York co Va early. Saj
I was told at one time, hear say only, that our Howards were one of the first families of the JamesTown Colony. Any thoughts or actual info?
Bob,
I don’t know about the Jamestown question. I know with a brief check that they were here as early as 1630? Anyway, See the Lumbee Indian surname project? While not listing Howard, there are numerous Hunt and Allen families. The Howard and Allen and Hunt and Allen and Howard and Hunt marriages are MANY. I’ve known about this project for some time and posted the link here before but I don’t think anyone commented? Just one example:
Saphronia Hunt born 1843 Granville co NC is daughter of Sarah Allen Howard and Samuel Hunt. SArah is one of Groves Howard and Hannah Allen’s children. But Samuel Hunt is the grandson of my Ralph Hunt and Dina Anderson. Many of the names are hard to sort with so many John, William, James, etc. But on that Lumbee list is Drury Allen (more than one) and they’re all related. The earliest Drury born about 1714 is brother to my Joseph. Descendants of he and brothers are on this list. Saj
saj wrote: Bob,
I don’t know about the Jamestown question. I know with a brief check that they were here as early as 1630? Anyway, See the Lumbee Indian surname project? While not listing Howard, there are numerous Hunt and Allen families. The Howard and Allen and Hunt and Allen and Howard and Hunt marriages are MANY. I’ve known about this project for some time and posted the link here before but I don’t think anyone commented? Just one example:
Saphronia Hunt born 1843 Granville co NC is daughter of Sarah Allen Howard and Samuel Hunt. SArah is one of Groves Howard and Hannah Allen’s children. But Samuel Hunt is the grandson of my Ralph Hunt and Dina Anderson. Many of the names are hard to sort with so many John, William, James, etc. But on that Lumbee list is Drury Allen (more than one) and they’re all related. The earliest Drury born about 1714 is brother to my Joseph. Descendants of he and brothers are on this list. Saj
Where was this post?
Have you thought about or enrolled with the Lumbee’s?
Need to answer that question. Enrollment? No, haven’t thought of that….because, I really think that there is a mixture here of various tribal connections. Not just Lumbee. Saponi too. And Tuscorara..maybe Pamunkey. Maybe others…still working on that. If I could enroll right here on this forum that would be great. I feel at home here without any offical recognition to one particular tribe. Just how it feels. Saj
Sue, I feel the same way. Most tribes want you to forsake all others. I carry the blood of many tribes and am proud to be VA/NC mixed blood. Saponitown is where I feel at home.
I agree that this is a geat comfortable place with many interesting and pleasant folks. I do however live in an area that if you don’t have NDN I.D. you’re not recognized. I do have some NDN I.D. locally but I would like to be able to attach some earlier family with some of these other peoples, Tribes. Fed. Rec. is nice to have. The CDIB and Tribal I.D. is required to participate in some Powwows.
Cousin Bob….. It totally slipped by me until I pulled the Jones/Collins thread back up. Please read that thread and see how mixed up that group is. I descend from Mary Howard married Hubbard Cozart. She was daughter of Henry Groves Howard and Hannah Allen. This is not a line that I have worked on so I didn’t have Groves Howard’s parents. This takes another of my lines back to original settler.
Sue….. can you take Hannah Allen back any further?
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