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Here is an article that I found interesting, the Carmel Indians of Ohio.
http://www.melungeon.org/index.cgi?BISKIT=337650726&CONTEXT=cat&cat=10059
Also check the 1880 Hancock county TN census for great leads .!
Editor’s note: That url has changed to http://www.melungeon.org/node/110. Must be the same article.
Tom,
That is interesting. Some of these sites keep updating and it’s good to keep checking. Good links..thanks. Saj
Thank you for posting the link…I have read (and read) the book and it is an interesting accounting of the Carmel Indian settlement in Highland County, OH and my maternal ancestors. Some of my cousins still today reside in Carmel and we have visted with some of them and spoken with others and recorded the Carmel Cemetery for our own genealogical usage and pride and honor. Those persons that I did speak with when asked have ALL said that it was always their belief that the families that moved there from KY and VA (earlier) WERE in fact of Native American descent however, tribal affiliation was not mentioned to me on any of those occasions. Why they were called “Melungeons” is still somewhat of a controversy and perhaps we will never solve the truths of their complete ancestry. If you have a interest or surname affiliated with that particular group of ppl….I highly recommend reading the book because it speaks many truths and sheds light on the group as a whole. For further , more in depth examinination, Richard Carlson’s dissertation is another fine example of unveiling their history as well. I FINALLY “got my hands on” a copy of Miss Violet Morgan’s book so I’ll keep you abreast of how it pans out as a read….it is a ficticious account of a Native American love-story and life journey that is apparently based on one of my ancestors whom Miss Morgan interviewed at length. I also recently purchased the book: Indian Island in Amherst County and hope that it lends more details and solves some unanswered questions about my maternal lineage. I recently (FINALLY!) made some new connections and leads in my maternal line to the Vardy Collins line and the lines of Mahala Collins and to the Riddle family and to William Nichols (the “Tory” that was hung) so hopefully by digging moreso in and around the VA counties of Amherst and Wise and Lee and Rockbridge I will learn even more.
As a footnote about the article LINK that Bill posted: in section II it makes mention of the surname: WAIRMINE….when in fact that is a very common surname that runs throughtout our Carmel Indian ancestors with the execption of spelling….we have always had it spelled WIREMAN. In regaurds to the group as being mentioned as NOT being Cherokees who LEFT the tribe…it is my feeling and educated guess that some of them were in fact Cherokee but they simply chose NOT to relocate when prompted, instead choosing to remain with their family group and work the land, etc. In speaking with Mr. Carlson…he seems to think that I/we need to further examine the possibly Saponi and Monocan connection to our lines….he feels confident that the are far more likely affiliated with those tribes. Thus far…I am still examining that possibility but have no definative proof of either. I have been quite unsuccessful in fact, of locating any land deeds or abstracts for the Nichols (and variations) surnames, nor in commecting my State/Stanton Nichols/Knuckles to the Wise or Amherst County, VA censuses and deeds/etc. As to their presense in any particular geographical area that Price elludes to…to me, it appears that they migrated out of necessity…to seek work, to remain with their “kinfolk” and to avoid removal to the Western States, and to further avoid social demarkation and prejudices. I have no doubt that SOME of my maternal ancestors may well have had some African American mixing that did occur however I find it rude and ignorant that still yet today ppl cite and repeatedly deem them as mulattoes…it is exhausting to say the least. My maternal great great grandfather was William Nichols…he was a murderer yes….he was in fact executed for his crime and thus was rightfully punished for his misdeeds however….murderer though he may indeed have been…he was not LYING when arrsted when he stated that he was NOT a negro or a mulattoe or a mixed half-breed….article after article about him, and books galore make mention that he was such….he went to the electric chair stating that he was of Irish descent paternally and of Native American descent maternally….and in fact, historical documents that I have located indicate exactly that. To look at him….my mind screams: what?! who?! how?! and why?! I just want to know the full truth of his pleas of ancestry…and that is where it will end for me…with the peace of mind and knowledge that we came from THERE….wherever THERE may be, I’ll embrace it fondly.
To see the OH Dept of Corrections execution picture of William Nichols go to:
http://www.drc.state.oh.us/web/Executed/executed1.htm
William’s picture can be clicked on to enlarge…he was executed on 12/9/1904…purportedly the first man to be executed in the state of OH in “Old Sparky” after it failed in TX. None of the pictures I have seen or located of my maternal ancestrors appear to me to be the pheotypical AA “look” by way of physical traits…many of them, including myself were actually blonde haired and had the same carulean blue eyes that I (and 5 of my 6 siblings) have…about half are pale as a loaf of wonder bread (self included)….the rest are in fact dark…in hair…and skin color…and from personal experience I can self assuredly say that at birth and at death…we ALL wind up looking markedly Native American…my baby picture speaks well to it….I was olive skinned and had the most magnifiscent head of Jett black hair I ever couldhave imagined….and God bless them, my late granmother and mother, when lying in their final hours both looked magnifiscently Native as we grieved their loss. My mother was always told….and always told me and my siblings that we were the “Blue Eyed Cherokee” from KY…I’d sure like to find out, if not for she but for myself and my children and grandchildren to come. Thank you for the online “ear”. Best wishes for all of you in the New Year….happy hunting and health galore!~~~~Laurie
Hello Tom….thank you for the LINK…I inadvertently gave BILL credit for the link posting. Forgive me please. *smile*~~~Laurie
Laurie,
I too was born with straight black hair. For a while, it was kind of blond (one summer when I was a lifeguard, it was really blond); now after children, it is dark again.
Anyway, check out this link : http://www.saponitown.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=521&perpage=15&highlight=Andrew%20Jackson%20Sinkey&pagenumber=5
Doesn’t he look like your William Nichols? He is my gggggreat-uncle. He comes from a family that says it is Irish and Indian.
Techteach
Jinkies Techteach! You are right on the money in as much as my GG gpa and your ggggranduncle bear an uncanny resemblance. I have a few other pics of my William Nichols and every one is so very similar and telling to my eyes anyhow… in his court transcripts he was asked about his parents and their ancestry and stated the very same thing he did when he was arrested and called a “half-breed negro”…I have 6 separate documents from his children and grandchildren that also demark them as being of Irish & Indian mixed ancestry also….draft cards, death and funeral information etc. I just do not understand why in historical writtings and articles he is still labelled as he was in 1903 when he committed his crimes. I would *think* that way these years later….after racial discrimination took a backseat to human realization…he would (or we would rather) be afforded the truths rather than misinformed and uneducated supposition. *throws hands in the air* Thanks too for pointing out that page link from the Forum…it also makes mention of the RIDDLE surname which tied in with my maternal Nichols line as well…another William Nichols(b: abt 1750 in Granville Co, NC), a Tory who was hung, was married to Sarah Riddle (b: 1742 in Lewis Co, VA)….her parents being the dau. of Moses Riddle and Mary Gibson….she was one of 7 children all told and the history behind this part of my family is marked by both fascination and trajedy in the wake of political partisanship…hard times to say the very least. Jack Goins book titled: Melungeons: And Other Poineer Family speaks at length about these families and their trials and tribulations in and around Hancock Co, TN and throughout VA and onward to places where his ancestral beginnings occurred. It is a very well written book and I DO recommend it as an historical read for anyone with ties to the “Melungeon” surnames of Goins, Collins, Gibson , Riddle, Nichols, Spurlock, Arrington, McMillen, Lawson, Reed, Hurd, Fisher, Bledsoe, Minor, Sizemore, Bunch, Cole or Rogers. (and a few more that fail my memory at the moment.)
Thanks again and blessings to you in teh New Year~~~~Laurie
I don’t have any of BlueeyeLaurie’s names in my direct line, as far as I know. There are Collins, Nichols, and Bolins who intermarry, but none are the direct ancestor of the Sinkey in the picture. From the surnames listed as Carmel Indians, as I found them on a web site, this Sinkey has a grandmother named McCarty (I think I have that relationship right.), so maybe we might be related. My McCarty was from PA, but I don’t know where before PA.
Techteach
Hello again Techteach! *waves* I am not certain if or how our lines may or may not connect but I agree with Tom in that it COULD be likely we have some “cousindry” somedernwhere…irreguardless, I wanted to make mention of some of my “tree folks” that you make mention of, namely the McCarty name…currently, I have 10 with that given surname…a few I have minimal to no spousal or issue information on…but the 3 that have always been somewhat of a mystery to me because of their relatively close ties to my Nichols line are: 1. Thomas McCarty (b: abt 1795 in KY married Tempy Nichols (b: abt 1818 in KY)…they had a son named 2. Peter Buchanon “Buck” McCarty (b: 28 feb 1857 in Magoffin Co, KY) who married Jincey Collins (b: 22 mar 1853 in Magoffin Co, KY)…and they had 4 children….2 of whom married in my COLE line. Their children were: 3. Solena “Sola”, Jackson, Nancy & John. Solena actually married 5 men and 4 are men in my maternal lines *rolls eyes* so that makes for a twist huh?! The McCarty name in my tree primarrilly connects with the surnames Cole, Fletcher, Nichols, Bays & Smith. Tempy Nichols McCarty is one my “brick walls” as I can locate nothing further on her other than her approximate birth year and state and the 4 children she had with Thomas. Because her information is so ellusive, I cannot CONFIRM her identity in my Nichols database and “merge” her with a Temperance , called Tempy Nichols that was born in 1815 in Magoffin Co, KY….the daughter of a William Nichols and a Cole union.
Anywho….as to the Nichols and Collins and Cole surnames…I have numerous lines that weave like a tapestry for all of them maternally…from VA, NC, TN, KY and onward. Well over 10K ppl in my maternal database make it ridiculous to try and expound on any or many of them here. My hubby and I joke with one another and say fondly: if you are FROM KY or have KIN from KY…we’re related! (In fact, he and I oddly enough found that we are now related 4 different ways….crazy huh?) As to the surname Bolin/Bolyn…I have just 5 at present…having not examined them further just yet: 1. Alice Bolen (b: 1880 md. Henry Gibson), 2. Elijah Bolen (b: 1888 md. Cora Collins), 3. Malissa Bolen (dates UNK, md. Asa Collins) , 4. Noah Bolen (dates UNK md. Margaret Mullins) & 5. Celia Bolyn (dates UNK md. Daniel Martin Perkins).
I’ll close for now and leave it at that huh!? LOL Happy Hunting to all y’all. Blessings from Cincy~~~~Laurie
I have been emailing my cousin Deb this am. She reminded me that our McCarty is from Baltimore, MD.
There is an interesting/tragic story about the Nichols who marries into my Greens. She was the widow of one of the men who was involved in the Moravian massacre, Charles Bilderback. After the massacre, they were moving to Ohio when the Shawnee caught them. He was killed while she was spared. She married the Green who was a scout or something for the Zane who built the road, I think it was Zane’s trace. Her daughter, Bilderback’s daughter, also married a Green.
Techteach
Hello Tech…do you have a first name I can call you by? LOL I’m Laurie, in case you haven’t figured that out by now…tee hee. Anywho….that is indeed a tragic tale…and I would love to hear more about it…specifically…who was this said Nichols woman that married a Green or Bilderback? I do NOT have any Bildreback surnames in my tree at all however…the surname Green is sure there….having primarilly married into surnames of: JETT(my mother’s maiden name), Howard, Barnett, Arnett, Gibson, Collins, Joseph, & Risner. Looking forward to hearing more from you about this Shawnee massacre and how it may relate to my Nichols line…by names or dates or whatever you can afford me by way of details would be wonderful. On my mother’s JETT line…there were a few such trajedies that occurred as well…in once instance, the mother and children were all killed and the father and one son were sparred because they were out “travelling”…and in another instance, the mother and father were killed with numerous children and one one child survived the death. History is indeed interested but often marked by nearly-unbelievable tragedy and happenstance. You have a fabulous weekend…chat with you more anon! Blessings~~~~Laurie
Hello again Tech…Holy Smokes! I did a “google” search and learned plenty…and read plenty about the Zane’s Trail and the Scalping and Ruhama and the Moravian massacre….how utterly horrid indeed! *yuk* I know it is history but Lord help them all it is not easy to read such horror. I also happened upon a neat little Bilderback site that may or may not be yours or your families…with some lovely old pictures and I located the will of Ruhama Nichols also…I love the uniqueness of her name for one thing….and wonder now: does anyone have a clue as to who her parents or siblings were? I also finally figured out how to SEARCH this forum effectively and read numerous postings between a “Sinkey cousin” named Deb and Skydancer and yourself….very interesting. Not certain how or IF, but perhaps somewhere Skydancer’s ancestry and mine connect. I have a William Nichols who had a son named John and John in turn had a son by the name of ASBERRY Nichols….it rather struck me because she made mention of the name John ASHberry…the name, the names…it’s all in the names I say! I love their uniqueness but they are confounding moreso than not. Anywho….I wanted to let YOU know that I did some delving and did not want you to post a reply telling me about Ruhama that would be redundant….time saved is a good thing. I’ll close for now and just sit back and marvel at the “coincidences” of so much of this genealogy searching ….all the while being eternally grateful that I did not have to bear that which our ancestors did. Grace is a beautiful thing and there is great Grace in knowing their truths. Blessings and happy weekend hunting to you and yours~~~~Laurie
Blondeyelaurie,
Interesting that you have Barnett and Howard…..There is a Barnett Howard who married Jane Hunt…Barnett Howard, the son of Groves Howard and Hannah Allen out of Granville co NC..Hunt and Allen are two of my direct surnames..both marrying into various Howards. Barnett was born in 1768 in Granville. Sue J
Laurie,
1900 Knott Co., Ky; ED45 Mag. Dist 3, Beaver, 2 June; Sheet 2B; Fm#25:
BOLEN, Noah; Farmer; Unk.1850, 50, m’d 20 Yrs, Tenn, Tn, Tn.
………., Margaret, wife, Aug 1850, 49, m’d 20, 8/6 living; Ky,Tn, Va.
………., Nathan, son, Feb 1881, 19, Ky.
………., Nowey E., son, Oct 1886, 13, Ky (is this Elijah?)
………., Sebastian, son, Aug 1889, 10, Ky.
GIBSON, Henry; s-in-law; Unk.1871, Tenn, Tn, Va.
…………, Alice, dau, Sept 1882, 17, m’d 2 yrs, 0/0 child., Ky.
…………………………………………..
1870 Floyd Co., Ky; Pct. 3; P.O. Prestonsburg; 1 Aug. p. 15: Fm# 98:
John R. BOLEN, 45, male, farmer, $200, $100, Tenn.
Louisa, 40, female, Ky
Ransom, 21, m, Tenn
NOAH, 18, m, Tenn*******
Martha, 14, f, Tenn
Wheatly, 12, m, Tenn.
Nathan, 13, m, Ky.
……………………………………………
(John and Louisa BOLAND are “46” & “40” in 1860 with the same kids as in 1870, plus Rice b.1843, Enoch b.1845, Fanny b.1851, Cynthia b.1855.)
Next door to them in 1860 is Preston WALLEN, 45, Va, with Wheatly BOLAND, 7, and Louisa ALLEN, 14, living with them.
Did Daniel Martin Perkins, b. 1885 Ky, move to Oklahoma?
Tempy and Buckhanan McCarty are listed on the 1870 Magoffin Census twice. Once in the household of Joseph Nickle, 58, Ky, (and Naomi “Omey” Cole Nickle), and once next door to John, 38, & Susanna Nickle, 45, Ky., but in the later case her age is inflated a lot which may indicate that someone else gave out that info.
I found her & Thomas McCarty on the 1860 Magoffin census with children Louisa, 6, and Peter B., 3, all listed as born Ky.
Interesting group of people.
Bill
Hello Saj…thanks for replying to my posting…I looked in my FTM files and do not currently have a Barnett Howard in my tree nor the Allen female you mentioned as being his wife…that is not to say that they don’t rightfully belong there either…LOL…I spent about 2 months mid year expanding my Howard line and trying to make more sense of it….and currently have about 400 Howard individuals indexed…they primarilly married into the following surnames: Jett, Nichols, Arnett, Barnett, Howard, Shepherd, Hensley, Salyer, LeMaster, Joseph, Lovely, Cole, Risner, Allen, Wireman, Patrick & Conley.
As to the ALLEN surname…I have fewer…about 130 or so…and they married primarilly into the surnames of: Nichols, Gibson, Watson, Cole, Bailey, Poe, Conley, Wireman, Hale, Arnett, Stewart, Risner, Salyer, & Howard families.
If your “people” were from NC, TN, KY, VA and OH…I’m gonna hafta say: we are surely related somehow girl!
Enjoy your weekend and thanks again for the reply. Blessings~~~Laurie
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