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I am still doing research on Queen Alliquippa of McKeesport/Pittsburgh and her tribe. The Story goes that George Washington had a meeting with Queen Alliquippa and Half King in the fall of 1754 to discuss issues with the French Fort in Pittsburgh.
It is said that the title of Half King was given to a group of Native Americans in order for them to represent tribes in various discussion with the English. Has anyone ever heard of this?
When I read your posting, I thought I recalled reading that it had something to do with the fact that he was not Iroquois and was in charge of refugee Indians in PA, like Shikellemy (Chief Logan’s father). I see that Wikipedia poses the question you posed. I found a description similar to what I remembered at this link : http://www.thehalfking.com/hk/. You might question its source, being a description on a web site of a bar called the “Half-King,” but the author of this description is an associate professor of history.
Techteach
Hi
The issue is and it’s very important to my research, does anyone know of another Half King besides the Half King with Queen Alliquippa at the meeting with George Washington.
I notice in old records it states:
“The Half King” and “The Hanging Maw” as if they were titles.
I kind of have a wild tale on why I think he is called “The Half King” but in order for my tale to have at least some level of truth to it, I need to know if there are any other Half Kings recorded in History. Thanks for the tip.
The question I have now is at what point does a story become so rediculous that it should never be checked by a simple DNA test. This is what happened with me in the Queen Alliquippa, Half King story. I believe I am a descendent of this pair. At least I have spotty paperwook from my family in Mckeesport PA that points in that direction. I believe Gov Alexander Spotswood is involved and the Spotswood Foundation feels the story is to rediculous to test against even though they have the ability to do the test and I will pay all costs.
Larry,
I think that I have seen that Half-King that was used by the settlers. I seem to remember that it is a title that went to others, not just the Delaware who pops up when you google this. While I am not sure where I read this, this entry at Wikipedia would seem to indicate that my memory might not be entirely faulty, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athelstan_of_England, since it was a title used for a British royal person.
Also, I do not understand the DNA situation. I am not sure what you can prove of the story through DNA. If you take the male test, you will determine if your direct male ancestor was NA. If you take the female test (mtDNA), you will find out of you direct female ancestor was NA. These two tests only test the straight lines, i.e. my niece would have the same mtDNA results as I do, even though her father is African-American. If you take the percentage test, you get an estimate of the amount of NA you have. The latter was all I could take. The results, however, tended to confirm what I suspected from genealogy.
Techteach
Hi
Remember I have at least some paperwork that points in the direction to Alexander Spotswood.
My theory is simple.
That Alexander Spotswood had a son by Queen Alliquippa and his name is Half King. Then Half King had a son and he was adopted by the Wealthy Myers family of Pittsburgh/Mckeesport and named him William Myers. The Myers family moved to Kentucky after the Whiskey Rebellion. William Myers, the adopted son, is really William Spotswood and he marries Caroline Grundy. Her Uncle is Felix Grundy the US Attorney General in 1838.
In 1825 a court order requires the Spotswood estate in Kentucky to be sold to William Grundy, Caroline Grundys brother for $5. Later William Grundy dies in 1853 and the estate is left to his sister Caroline Grundy Myers who is really Caroline Grundy Spotswood. Caroline Grundy’s 8 year old grandson, my great grandfather Jacob Myers moves back to Pittsburgh/McKeesport area to live with relatives.
A simple $250 male line 32 point Y-DNA test will tell if my very wild story and my spotty paperwork could be correct or not. If my last name is indeed Spotswood, then the test will be positive. If it is positive, it may simply mean that a 23 year old Major George Washington is Kin to Queen Alliquippa and Half King and that’s why he was given the job in the first place.
Boy, I had to map that out to follow it. Assuming it is correct, your DNA results would match those of male Spotwoods. I would check and see if they have a family name DNA project online.
This is very interesting to me BTW. My ggggrandmother who was NA was born in Beaver County (I think that this is where Alliquippa was.) She marries my ggggrandfather who supposedly built the first school in Pittsburgh, according to one of those county histories that was written in the late 1800s. And on my grandfather’s side, my gggggrandfather was a surveyor for Washington and went on to be involved in the massacre of Chief Logan’s family.
Techteach
The only Spotswood name on the web is the Spotswood foundation who do not want to test against such a wild story. Remember I have at least some paperwok to support this. The Foundation has looked at some of this paperwok and said it’s doesn’t match.
Example, the Spotswood Foundation says Fort Duquesne was never in Pittsburgh because Pittsburgh did not exist in 1754. That Mckeesport wasn’t Mckeesport until 1795 so Queen Alliquippa can’t be from McKeesport. Therefore my story doesn’t add up so no test.
This is technically correct but very misleading. Fort Duquesne/Fort Pitt building itself is in downtown Pittsburgh. Just because Fort Duquesne was at the Forks of the Ohio in 1754 before Pittsburgh was called Pittsburgh doesn’t mean the building was never in Pittsburgh like they want me to believe. Same issue with McKeesport and Alliquippa’s village. Plus my paperwok never says Pittsburgh or Mckeesport. I say the city names in the emails because it’s where I live.
I have the exact wording of the finding if interest.
I am sure I am being sandbagged
I would be interested. You can send it via my email. Click on my name and it pops up with a way to email me. Besides, I just checked if familytreedna has a Spotswood family project. It has several. One of those was the Fraser clan project, that includes 2 of my surname, Sankey and McCartney.
Techteach
This is very interesting. The Fraser land grant is right next to the Myers land grant at Braddocks field. That is, Braddock Field where the battle was fought is on the Fraser/Myers land grant.
Hey Larry , I think that you and Tech are really on to something here, especially checking the names that Tech. has mentioned.
Getting sand bagged is normal for such research but don’t get side lined, if there’s something there Iam sure that your research will prove it out!
thanks
Actually I have so much information on this that it has overloaded the Spotswood Foundation. If you go back and read the story about George Washington meeting with Queen Alliquippa and Half King with Alexander Spotswood in mind, the story really comes alive. The Spotswoods are intermarried into the Washington’s, the Lewis’s and the Henrys, The Lewis’s are married into the Jeffersons.
With that you have the 1753 Logstown treaty of Pittsburgh signed off my Peter Jefferson, Thomas Jeffersons father. Then you have a 23 year old Major George Washington meeting with Queen Alliquippa and Half King in 1754George Washington cleary states in his log that Queen Alliquippa’s son is at the meeting. Then you have General Braddock with George Washington and Hanging Maw, who I think is another Spotswood relative, trying to kick out the French in the summer of 1755. Add the Spotswood name and what we have is MOTIVATION that lasts 50 years to the Lewis and Clark boat leaving Pittsburgh McKeesport area Aug 30 1803 at 11am
I have had several professional Genealogist contact me to explain their professional position on DNA. DNA should never be used to contradict established paperwork that has been proven to be correct by the test of time. In other words, even though DNA is OK to use for the conviction of defendants in a court case, it is not good enough to contradict established paperwork and should never be used to do so.
Well I guess I understand.
You mean just like there is no Eastern Blackfoot ID, these folks will try and get rid of the precieved “upstarts ” any way they can, remember you’ll upset the history of “Washington ” with this, and that may open up a huge can of worms for some one! Just a thought but I would not let precieved establish paper work out wiegh science!
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