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Here is some saponi history…found here at saponitown and some other links…
Excerpt:
Saponi
from
The Indian Tribes of North America
by John R. Swanton
Evidently a corruption of Monasiccapano or Monasukapanough, which, as shown by Bushnell, is probably derived in part from a native term “moni-seep” signifying “shallow water.” Paanese is a corruption and in no way connected with the word “Pawnee.”
Connections – The Saponi belonged to the Siouan linguistic family, their nearest relations being the Tutelo.
Location.- The earliest known location of the Saponi has been identified by Bushnell (1930) with high probability with “an extensive village site on the banks of the Rivanna, in Albemarle County, directly north of the University of Virginia and about one-half mile up the river from the bridge of the Southern Railway.” This was their location when, if ever, they formed a part of the Monacan Confederacy. (See also North Carolina, Pennsylvania, and New York.)
http://www.saponitown.com/Saponi.htm
Here is a link to a map that show “where the Saponi were in 1640,” prior to Ft. Christanna.
http://falcon.jmu.edu/~ramseyil/vaindians.htm
http://www.oldhalifax.com/county/NativeAmericanIndians.htm
http://www.juntosociety.com/native/in1899.htm
http://www.nconnect.net/~frito/Indians.htm#Southwest%20Region
http://www.virginiaplaces.com/nativeamerican/6indianstoday.html
http://www.sosu.edu/lib/subnativeamerican.htm
I threw some other links in too…thought they were good resources:)
Oops, forgot to paste the link to the 1640 map…
Here is a link to a map that show “where the Saponi were in 1640,” prior to Ft. Christanna.
http://www.hiddenhistory.com/PAGE3/ww-njers.htm
I’m not sure if this relates…but kinda weird….we not only have the surname martin…but also Bedford Va….preacher…in Coffee county Tenn…..and this person’s name is Drury Dobbins Martin.
MARTIN
Does anyone know descendants of William MARTIN in the 1880 Coffee Co., TN, census? He was born in Bedford Co. in 1847 and is shown with his grandfather Elder William “Cedar Billy” Martin and unmarried aunt Martha “Patsy” Martin in the 1850 census. When his father Drury Dobbins Martin remarried, William is with him and his new stepmother Jane Wilson Martin in the 1860 census. In 1880 William is shown as a farmer in District 6 of Coffee Co. with his wife Elizabeth,and 5 daughters and 2 sons: Nancy A. MARTIN, 13; John H. MARTIN, 11; Ida E. MARTIN, 9; Mary E. MARTIN, 7; William F. MARTIN, 5; Alice MARTIN, 3; and Ada MARTIN,1. Also William’s father Druery D.(Drury Dobbins) Martin, age 64, is shown living with him. Drury sometimes performed marriage ceremonies in Coffee County. Does anyone know anything about his family?
http://bellsouthpwp.net/C/a/CanCofHist/coffee/2002qy.htm
good work sammarroq…I’m going to check them right now….I just contact the church drury dobbins went to….hopfully they have a photo of him…I really want to see a photo of him….especially now that I found out he came from a indian school and was the grandson of william collins
More links with some good information…
http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ncbertie/tuscarra.htm
http://www.unc.edu/~mmaynor/biblio.html
usclancaster.sc.edu/library/nasc/blumer/TJBcontainerlist.doc
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/19628
http://genealogy.wikia.com/wiki/North_Carolina
http://www.san.beck.org/11-9-VirginiaEtc1664-1744.html
I just found this which is about the Goings/Gowen family.
apprently the Goings married intot he Morgan family of Ga (which just so happens the Morgan family of the same general area had married into my Petty family which had came to Ga from York county and was Catawba indians…this petty family was also in the Saponi locations before coming to York county)….this Goings family apprently also married into the Spears family which was also another Ga indian family and is connect to the dobbins/Collins family thru marriages in Ga…..and it just so happens one of these goings was named Drury dobbins Goings.
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~gowenrf/Gowenms133.htm
One of Drury Dobbins’ great great great grandaughters was from the Ga Spears family.
http://boards.ancestry.ca/surnames.dobbins/53.234.235.249.250.252/mb.ashx
Is our families just big magnets to each other? 🙂
good work on the links Sammarroq
I see you have Johnson in your family surname list…would you believe that two of my dad’s sisters had married 2 brothers that was Johnson 🙂 they live out in North Ga but I have not seen them in like forever….maybe like 1993.
I’m telling you…our families are magnets lol
Woah that one map is awesome..it shows the Saponi had traveled right up there with the Monacan. I also see the Nanticoke listed (the Haliwa Saponi say they are made up of the Saponi and Nanticoke…or If I remember right that is what their website states).
Is that 1640 or 1673 though? I see 1673 wrote on it under moneton
I think the timeline that Linda has posted on the main page of Saponitown does a good job describing Saponi travels…of course, there were probably smaller groups that dispersed in other directions…
http://www.saponitown.com/timeline.htm
http://www.saponitown.com/Blackfoot.htm
Not sure what’s up with the map dates??
I really want to see a photo of him….especially now that I found out he came from a indian school and was the grandson of william collins
Do you happen to have any more info on that William Collins?
My line is supposed to come from a William Collins, but am not entirely sure which one. He wound up in the border counties of VA/NC that overlap the Goinstown area (Stokes, Pittsylvania, Henry/Patrick). He may have come from Albemarle, but is possible he came from Orange Co., NC. Is also possible he didn’t come from anywhere. ;~)
I don’t have alot of info…his wife was named Sarah. I’m not sure how many children he had either. There is a bible that Drury dobbins owned…and he has a huge amount of the family history recorded in that bible…however I’m not sure who has that bible. Alot of churches around NC and SC supposedly have alot of info on drury dobbins also.
There is a website that one of my distant cousins has which has alot of drury dobbins’ family bible info. In the Guion miller application by nancy hollifield and W.S dobbins (sent in about 1898) it states how the family originally came down from VA. I’m not sure if the Drury dobbins bible has been published or not but apprently alot of people have read it before (usually alot of the church folks around NC and SC since apprently Drury was one of the main Church people in the catawba areas, he also taught alot of reverns that later went on to be other churches reverns).
I’ve checked with some of the historical societies and the national land marks places in NC which has a collins plantation and school….and all three of them places assured me the william collins mentioned in the drury dobbins bible would not have came from there…..they have all stated that the only william collins that would have matched the migration pattern and date of birth would have been the louisa VA one. Also with the Grandsons going to indian schools matches up pretty good also. Another good thing is that william collins’ daughter married into the same quaker family that was in goose creek VA that was living on the Monacan land.
susannah collins and William Dobbins married in granville NC (was orange county at the time)and then headed right to the heart of catawba territory (york county).
I right off hand do not have any info on other kids but I’m 100 percent sure he had other kids….I do not think william collins left for york county either…he had to have stayed in the orange county area or have traveled to another area……it’s possible he went to the goinstown area. I think susannah collins had a brother or cousin which traveled with her because Jerimiah collins was in South Carolina and I have a photo of Jerimiah and he has a indian history…there is no question Jerimiah collins is indian.
FIRST GENERATION
1. William Dobbins Sr was born on 17 Feb 1740 in Granville Co NC. He appeared on the census in 1790 and 1800 in Rutherford Co NC. He died on 23 Sep 1814 in Ellenboro, Rutherford Co and was buried in the Dobbins – Harrill family cemetery, Cleveland Co NC. He was a farmer in Rutherford Co NC He was a member of State Line Baptist Church, Cherokee Co SC. As a Revolutionary War patriot, he was paid 52 pounds, 9 shillings, 8 pence sterling for sundry provisions in 1781 and 1782. He moved from Granville County NC to York District SC between 1761 and 1776 and then moved to Rutherford County NC.
He married Susannah Collins (daughter of William Collins and Sally) about 1760 in Granville Co NC. She was born on 27 Feb 1738 in Granville Co NC. She appeared on the census in 1790, 1800 and 1830 in Logan’s Township, Rutherford Co NC. In 1830 she was living with her son Drury. She died on 1 May 1832 in Rutherford Co and was buried in the Dobbins – Harrill family cemetery. She was a member of State Line Baptist Church. They had the following children:
+2 James Ballard Dobbins Sr.
+3 William “Will” Dobbins Jr.
+4 Mary “Mollie” Dobbins.
+5 Frances “Frannie” Dobbins.
+6 Jonathan Dobbins Sr.
+7 Ezekiel Dobbins.
+8 Rev. Drury Dobbins.
James Ballard dobbins is my line 🙂
I think the Granville NC for susanna was a guess because thats where she was married. in the Guion miller application which was done about 1898….it states Virginia.
Now the Burwell school of Hillsborough Orange county NC.
It had housed some Collins but these Collins came from the Coast. I’ve talked to the school before and I have a letter around here somewhere and they told me my william Collins would not of been the collins that came to the school for housing.
http://www.burwellschool.org/about/
The Burwell School Historic Site is owned and operated by the Historic Hillsborough Commission, a 501 c(3) non-profit organization. The Commision was created by an Act of the 1963 North Carolina General Assemply and the Commision’s 34 members are appointed by the Governor. The Commission’s mission is “to maintain and preserve the Burwell School Historic Site; to interpret the history of 19th century Hillsborough for the enrichment of the public; and to celebrate and promote the culture and heritage of Hillsborough and Orange County”.
In the three decades prior to the Civil War, the property was the home of Robert and Anna Burwell, their twelve children and the enslaved members of their household. The Burwell Residence (ca. 1821, 1846) and a rare brick Necessary (ca. 1837) remain from this period.
In the summer of 1837, the Burwells opened their landmark school, one of the earliest female academies in North Carolina, in a brick school building in their backyard.
During the Civil War, the Burwell School acquired the nickname of the “Beehive” as it served as a temporary residence for over 30 enslaved people and members of the Collins and Warren families from coastal North Carolina.
Now the collins that came there came from the somerset plantation.
http://www.nchistoricsites.org/somerset/somerset.htm
I’ve talked to this place also and they said the Collins there came to the Orange county area during the civil war.
Somerset Place is a representative state historic site offering a comprehensive and realistic view of 19th-century life on a large North Carolina plantation. Originally, this atypical plantation included more than 100,000 densely wooded, mainly swampy acres bordering the five-by-eight mile Lake Phelps, in present-day Washington County.
During its 80 years as an active plantation (1785-1865), hundreds of acres were converted into high yielding fields of rice, corn, oats, wheat, beans, peas, and flax; sophisticated sawmills turned out thousands of feet of lumber. By 1865, Somerset Place was one of the upper South’s largest plantations.
From Somerset’s earliest days through the end of the Civil War, people of different races, legal, and economic status lived on the property. A labor force of almost 200 men, women, and children was assembled before 1790. They were black and white, enslaved and free. Over the life of the plantation, three generations of owners, around 50 white employees, two free black employees, and more than 850 enslaved people lived and worked on the plantation.
Nearly all the newly emancipated black families left the plantation before 1870. The financially crippled owners eventually sold and left the property, never to return.
Baum, Bennett, Blacksmith, Blount, Caburrus, Collins, Dickinson, Dixon, Elsy, Gaskins, Hamilton, Harvey, Jones, King, Kit, Littlejohn, Luton, Mack, Marsh, Newbern, Nubel, Payne, Phelps, Sawyer, Trotter
Them are surnames associated with the Somerset place plantation.
Owners was:
(1786 – 1865) Josiah Collins III: founder of Somerset Place (his 5 sisters went to school in New York City along with Mary riggs)
(1786 – 1865) Mary (Riggs) Collins: wife of Josiah Collins (she came from Newark New Jersey)
Partial List of Negros at Lake Phelps (Somerset Place) 07/01/1839 (by surname). Name in quotes is slave name as given by owner.
- Baum, Jack Madison “Jack Baum”
- Bennett, Peter “Peter King“: son of King and Mima Bennett
- Blacksmith, Fred “Fred Blacksmith”: a blacksmith by trade
- Blount, Matilda Caburrus “Chaney”: daughter of Matilda and Joseph Caburrus, married Thompson Blount
- Blount, Susan “Young Suck”: married Granville Collins
- Caburrus, Jack“Jack Caburrus”: purchased from Stephen Caburrus
- Caburrus, Mary Bennett “Mazy”: daughter of Stephen and Eve Bennett, married Henry Caburrus
- Caburrus, Matilda Collins “Tilla”: daughter of Guinea Jack and Fanny Collins; married Joseph Caburrus
- Collins, Jack “Guinea Jack”: one of 80 slaves brought from Africa to the plantation in 1786
- Dickinson, Moses “Young Moses”: purchased from Dr. Samuel Dickinson
- Dickinson, Peter “Peter Gaskins“: son of a slave listed as Lydia Gaskins who was originally held by Dr. Samuel Dickinson, sold to Gaskins, then to Collins
- Dixon [Dickinson], Peter “Peter Mack“: son of Mack and Hannah Payne Dixon
- Harvey, John “John”: son of Ishmael and Nancy Harvey
- Jones, Jack “Jack Kit“: son of Chloe Payne-wife of Fred Blacksmith; Jack’s father was a slave named Kit
- Littlejohn, Fred “Fred Elsy*”: son of Peter and Elsy Littlejohn
- Littlejohn, John Hamilton “Hamilton”: listed by his middle name
- Littlejohn, Mary “Mary Elsy*”: daughter of Peter and Elsy Littlejohn
- Littlejohn, Peter Sr. “Peter Marsh“: born on Littlejohn plantation, sold to King Luton, then to Cyrus Marsh, then to Josiah Collins
- Littlejohn, Peter Jr. “Peter Elsy*”: son of Peter and Elsy Littlejohn
- Littlejohn, Susan “Suck Elsy“: daughter of Peter and Elsy* Littlejohn
- Matilda
- Newbern, Mary “Mary Newbern”: purchased from a Davis family in Newbern, NC
- Nubel, Mary “Mary Nubel”: father’s name was Nubel
- Phelps, Moses
- Sawyer, Jack Sr. “Jack Swine”: a hog tender, purchased from Methias Sawyer
- Sawyer, Jack Jr. “Jack, Jr”: son of Jack and Betty Sawyer
- Sawyer, Mary “Mary Swine”: daughter of Jack and Betty Sawyer
- Susan “Old Suckey”
- Trotter, Dave “John Trotter”: named Dave at birth, when his father John Trotter died in 1829, his name was changed to John
* the given name of the mother was generally carried by the children of field hands
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