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Four Cats,
I mentioned the Allen because this Charles Madison Allen descends from Robert Jr. brother to my direct Joseph. Also, you probably have the Creed info on Melissa Creed, but going back from there is Matthew Creed and ? McKinney (forget first name right now) but going back further is a Matthew Creed born in Va. circa 1689. Everything I can find on him lists unknown wife and that he died in Caroline co Va after 1750. I wonder if it is after because there is a will somewhere written 1750? Don’t know for sure. Anyway, I only find one Matthew Creed in that time frame. Some show only Lucy Creed as his child and some show only Matthew Creed Jr. I think same line as Matthew and ? McKinney. Lucy is in my direct line. Have you seen the Creed descendants of Highland co Ohio coming out of WV? If you don’t have that info I’ll find it again. Saj
Hi Saj,
Thank you for the information!
I do have some information on the Creed Family, but haven’t had much time to look into that line in depth. I briefly ran what I found last summer on my direct line of Creeds, and wound up in Orange Co. VA. with the family living near the Saponis in that area.
One thing I’ve noticed is the Allen, Davis, and Griffin families living within a close radius of the Barnes’ since they originally settled in the Isle of Wight – Nansemond, VA area.
Since I posted here last, I have found a death certificate for John A. Barnes, who was most likely Malissa J. Creed’s husband. As there were eight John Barnes’ born in NC and VA between 1854-1856, most of whom could be placed in my direct line, I have had my hands full trying to figure out which one was the right one for almost a year now. Unfortunately, he is not Sandford and Frances’ son, born in 1855.
What has thrown many of us off, is John A. Barnes was listed on the 1900 Tazewell County, VA Census as being born in “January, 1855 in NC”.
The other red herring was Malissa (Creed) Barnes was listed as “widowed” on the 1910 Census for Brooke County, WV. Looking at Everett Bert Barnes’s death certificate (my Great Grandfather and John’s son), my Great Uncle Frank has John’s birthplace as Tazewell, VA.
The death certificate for our John A. Barnes, who died in Brooke County, WV shows the following-
John Albert Barnes (Albert makes since, since we have a Burt as his son)
He was born on Sept. 20, 1856, and died on January 26, 1917.
John’s parents were listed as John and Elizabeth Barnes.
I have started looking at a Barnes Family listed in the 1860 Marion-Wood, VA Census who I have not seen before-
Father- John Barnes (b. 1811, VA)
Mother – Elizabeth Wine (Wynne?, b. 1822)
Children-
– .O {color:yellow;} a:link {color:yellow !important;} <!–.sld {left:0px !important; width:6.0in !important; height:4.5in !important; font-size:103% !important;} .O {color:yellow;} .O1 {color:yellow;} .O2 {color:yellow;} a:link {color:yellow !important;} Edward Barnes 1851 – ????
–Sarah Barnes 1852 – ????
–John Barnes 1856 – ????
–Emma Barnes 1859 – ????
There is a .O {color:yellow;} .O1 {color:yellow;} a:link {color:yellow !important;} Marq Pakel 1798 – ????, listed as an “old lady” living with this family
There is also a John A. Barnes (1812-1894), who married Martha Washer in the Mason-Wray lines. He was the son of John Barnes and Elizabeth Bass (daughter of Arthur and Agnes Bass).
Another observation I’ve made is the Barnes’ may have picked up the Everett name from the Griffin family, since I’ve seen it used in their naming. I have also looked into William Everett Barnes’ line, who married Pheraby Jane Council (Duck) in Isle of Wight, VA.
I’m going to look into this John and Elizabeth Barnes family over the long weekend, and I’ll let you know if anything of interest comes from it.
Best Regards,
Four Cats
Four Cats,
Is this one you have seen?
http://www.genealogy.com/users/k/o/d/Julia-W-Kodad/GENE10-0012.html
Have you seen a third marriage for Lizzie or Malissa Creed to James Vandyke?
Saj
Hi Saj,
Thanks!
Yes, Malissa Creed is the correct wife for John Barnes. After looking at this the past week, Sandford is either a nickname or a middle name for John Barnes’ father. Other than the few Census’ and a NC marriage record where Sandford appears, there’s nothing else on him.
There are about nine John Barnes’ born in the 1855 timeframe that could fit into this line, and I’m patiently looking at each one to figure out which one is right. To make things even more fun, I just found a John Burnes born in 1855 in Clay, KY (not far from where I’m already looking) who descends from the Asher-Belvins lines with rumored Cherokee ties.
This one is indeed the toughest genealogy connection I’ve ever encountered.
Have a good weekend!
Four Cats
Hi Saj,
After finding the correct death certificate for John Barnes and running across a copy of the 1850 Dinwiddie County, VA Census, here is the correct line. I’ve found at least 14 John Barnes’ born between 1854-1856 in North Carolina and Virginia, which made this quite a challenge. Based on the number of Arthurs and Everetts in my line, I suspected this was the correct line for some time, but haven’t been able to put any documentation together to support this theory until now.
Naturally, I caution that my work below could contain some errors, so please be careful.
Before I close the door on the Stokes County Barnes’, I found that the Turbefield Barnes line originated with Jamestown immigrant, James Barnes who arrived in 1637. They moved through the Guilford/Stokes, NC area, and eventually settled in Nolansville, TN (http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com). Although they didn’t stay long, they sure tangled a few Barnes lines and make a Stokes County connection one of the toughest to prove. Something else about some of the Barnes’ in this area is that they combined their first names on the Census’. There was a Joab Barnes (February 27, 1812 – October 30, 1897), who was actually Joseph Abraham Barnes. The Sandford Barnes I was chasing is most likely Samuel S. Barnes, (1829 – February 08, 1863) who was born in Randolph County, NC, and moved to Stokes County, NC. He died during the Civil War, which likely explains the family mysteriously dropping off the map.
The revised Barnes line goes like this-
Generation A-
Father
John A. Barnes 1856 – January 06, 1915
Mother
Malissa (Creed) Barnes April 31, 1869 – ????
Children
Ida Barnes February 12, 1888 – ????
Mollie Barnes December, 1890 – ????
Martha Barnes February, 1892 – ????
Arthur Creed Barnes May 09, 1893 – August 07, 1949
Everett Burt Barnes March 17, 1897 – January 13, 1937
(Married Malissa Mitchell)
Nora Mae Barnes June 11, 1899 – ????
John Shade Barnes March 01, 1901 – March 10, 1957
Minnie Barnes 1902 – January 07, 1922
John Arthur Barnes, Jr. 1906 – ????
Tina Barnes 1908 – 19(??)
(1900 Tazewell County, VA Federal Census)
John and Malissa were also enumerated on the 1880 Federal Census in Norfolk, VA
Generation B-
Father
John R. Barnes 1823 – ????
Born in Virginia ?
Mother
Elizabeth (Unknown) Barnes 1825 – ????
Children
Martha A. Barnes 1850 – ????
John A. Barnes 1856 – ????
Married Malissa Creed
Joseph Barnes 1859 – ????
Susan Barnes 1859 – ????
William Barnes 1868 – ????
Winston Barnes 1870 – ????
All children born in VA
(1870 Dinwiddie, VA Federal Census)
Generation C-
This family will be familiar to some researchers-
Father
James Barnes 1793 – February 11, 1872
Born in Gates County, NC, died in Nansemond County, VA
Married Elizabeth Holland in April 04, 1818
Mother
Elizabeth (Holland) Barnes 1793 – ????
Married James Barnes on April 04, 1818
Children
William Everett Barnes November 20, 1820 – October 11, 1885
Born in Brunswick County, VA, and died in Nansemond County, VA
Married Pheraba Jane Council/Duck on 01/02/1843
John R. Barnes 1823 – ????
Born in VA
Buried in Barnes Cemetery on the East Side of Barnes Rd. in Suffolk, VA
“In Memory of James Barnes, Elizabeth Barnes, John R. Barnes (no dates)”
Dr. Thomas Holland Barnes May 28, 1831 – June 04, 1913
Born and died in Nansemond County, VA
Described as very tall
(1850 Isle of Wight County, VA Federal Census)
Generation D-
Father
Elias Barnes October 05, 1759 – ????
Married Rebecca Turner
Mother
Rebecca (Turner) Barnes ~ 1754 – 1830
Married Elias Barnes
Children
Unknown Female Barnes ~ 1790 – ????
Unknown Female Barnes ~ 1792 – ????
Sophia BARNES 1780 – 11 Apr 1878
Died in Platte, Missouri
Eleanor BARNES 1782 – ????
Catherine BARNES 1784 – ????
Fanny BARNES 1786 – ????
Elias BARNES, Jr. 1788 – ????
Unknown Female BARNES 1794 – ????
James Barnes 1793 – February 11, 1872
Born in Gates County, NC, died in Nansemond County, VA
Married Elizabeth Holland in April 04, 1818
Unknown Female BARNES 1798 – ????
All children born in North Carolina
(http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp)
This Barnes line continues back through Abraham Barnes’ Branch to Edward the Immigrant in Surry. This Turner connection has caught my eye, as they were moved from Hertford, NC to Randolph, MO, near the Blackfoot Reservation in Missouri.
The Turner line continues back into Pasquotank County, NC, so I’m curious as to what may turn up here.
One thing that supports some earlier Saponitown research posted by Michael Dunn is this line ties into the Wilson County Fiveash line via a later Fort marriage as well.
The current known connection-
James Barnes 1668 – March 02, 1718
Born in Isle of Wight County, VA, lived in Cypress Swamp in 1702
Mother
Sarah (Fiveash) Barnes 1650 – ????
Rumored to be from the Wilson County, NC Tuscarora Fiveash Family
Another recent surprise involved Lissie Mitchell, who married my G-Grandfather Everett Barnes. I hit a dead end with my Mitchell line last year, and I took a second look recently. These Mitchells did not come up out of North Carolina, but were pushed down into Tazewell, VA from the head of the Ohio River in PA.
Father
Thomas J. Mitchell 01/1863 – 1897
Born in VA
Father was “Ash-kah-puck-see” (1900 Kickapoo Census, Robert Mitchell)
Mother
Margarett (Unknown) Mitchell 10/1865 – ????
Born in VA
Children
William Harvy Mitchell 02/11/1882 – 12/11/1945
Born in Tazewell Co. VA
(1900 Tazewell, Maiden Springs, VA Federal Census)
This line of Mitchells appear to be displaced Ohio River Dhegiha-Siouans, and were sent to the Kaw Indian Reservations in Council Grove, Morris, KS and Miami, Ottawa County, OK. (http://www.kawnation.com/Culture/culthist.html)
Best Regards,
Four Cats
Do you have any info on Hezekiah Inman who married Jane Hiatt? The resided, after the Revolutionary War, in Burke Co., NC. Jane Hiatt m/2nd to my 6th great grandfather, Ambrose Willilams. They had several unknown children together and moved to near Greenville, SC where they died in the 1790’s. Clydene
Clydene, I don’t have any information on a Hezekiah Inman or a Jane Hiatt. There were a lot of Inmans and Hiatts where I grew up at, Surry Co, NC/ Patrick Co VA. According to Bill Childs, Hezekiah is a name usually associated with the Quakers http://www.saponitown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=843 #5. So if your Inman and Hiatt were Quakers there’s probably a connection with my line of Hiatts. My direct ancestor, John Hiatt Jr. moved to New Garden Friend’s Meeting in what was then Rowan County, NC (now Guilford Co) in 1756/1757 from Hopewell Friends Meeting in Frederick Co VA. John Hiatt (son of John Hiatt Jr) moved from Hopewell Meeting to Cane Creek Meeting in Orange Co (now Alamance Co, NC) in 1759, then to New Garden Meeting in 1763, then to Deep River Meeting at its beginning in 1778. I have records for the siblings of my direct line, but John Hiatt Jr had two brothers George and William Hiatt and I don’t have records for them. You might could find Jane Hiatt and Hezekiah Inman in The Hiatt-Hiett Genealogy and Family History 1699-1949 book by William Perry Johnson. (I’ve seen many different spellings for my direct ancestors in different records such as Hyatt, Hiett, Hiot, Hiott, etc.) You might try looking at the records of the different meetings. I believe the Encyclopedia of American Quaker Genealogy by William Wade Hinshaw has records for the different meetings. Also Guilford College, a Quaker College, in Greensboro, NC has quaker records, see http://www.guilford.edu/about_guilford/services_and_administration/library/fhc/quaker.html. Hope that helps.
Thanks, Seems I seldom find any new information. Out of curiousity does anyone have lists of names from the Carlisle Indian School in Pennsylvania?
Hey Seneca Saponi, good to see you. Could you check your profile and make sure your email is up to date? I tried contacting you awhile ago and wasn’t sure if it got through.
Hi Folks,
Some new info on Sandford Barnes, whose full name was Richard Sanford Barnes, and a question-
After running Frances Corn’s line back, I am running into John A. Corn, Samuel Corn, and Jesse Corn. According to other posts regarding Richard and Vicki Haithcock’s book “Occaneechi Saponi and Tutelo of the Saponi Nation: aka Monacan and Piedmont Catawba; Includes The Eastern Band of the Cherokee and Lumbee Nation and Southeastern Indian Nations, etc.”, these names are listed as “Occaneechi- Saponi Heads of Families and others, Patrick County, Virginia in the 1810 census”.
Additionally, John A. Barnes’ wife, Malissa Creed had a grandfather by the name of Robert Thomas Rickman (1821 – ????). where a Thomas Rickman was also listed on the “Occaneechi- Saponi Heads of Families and others, Patrick County, Virginia in the 1810 census”.
I am curious if anyone else has confirmed this line of Corn’s having Occaneechi-Saponi ties? I have not found any ties yet between this line and that of Robert Brooks Corn of Little Texas in Alamance, NC, who was mentioned on the Occaneechi-Saponi Web Site.
Here’s the current family-
Barnes – Corn in Patrick County, VA
Father
– (Richard) Sanford Barnes 1827~1829 – February 08, 1863
• Born in Randolph, NC, married Frances E. Corn in 1851, died in Washington State
• Mother
– Frances E. Corn 1834 – ????
• Born in NC to John Corn and Elizabeth Adams
• Married Richard Sanford Barnes in Stokes County, NC in 1851
• Children
– Sarah Jane Barnes 24 Nov 1853
• Born in NC, died in Died in Glenoma, Lewis County, WA
– Mary A. Barnes 1854 – January 30, 1920
• Born in NC
– John A. Barnes January, 1855 – 1909
• Born in Tazewell, VA, buried in Washington State
• Married Malissa Creed in Tazewell, VA, daughter of Shadrack Creed and Mary Margaret Rickman
– Jeramiah A. Barnes 1859 – ????
• Born in VA
– Exony Barnes 1860- ????
• Born in VA
– William H. Barnes June 12, 1865 – March 17, 1922
• Born in Stokes, NC, died in Pocahontas, WV
– Elizabeth Barnes 1846 – ????
• Born in VA
(1860 Patrick County, VA Census)
Thanks!
Four Cats
Four Cats, I don’t know if it helps, but some of the Rickmans were registered as FPC in Patrick County. Here’s one list, but there are others:
http://files.usgwarchives.org/va/patrick/courts/colreg.txt
A note about that list of names. Patrick County is home to plenty of mixed bloods. A few folks have been listed as Indian on census, but none that I know of were identified by tribe.
Thanks Beeleaf!
I found a transcribed copy of the 1810 Patrick Co. Census last night, which does not have anything listing those families as “Occaneechi-Saponi”. Other than that, it is in agreement with what is in Richard Haithcock’s book. I am curious if the Haithcock book shows a reference or citation of the source of this data?
I do appreciate your thoughts on the Rickman’s as FPC, and I have other ancestors who were listed as “mullatoes of sundry color”. It is sad that we may never know exactly what tribe some of our ancestors may have come from. I have been lucky to have saved my wife’s Cherokee heritage from Dr. Walter Ashby Plecher’s destruction of family records in the 1930’s, and have proven that my Barnes line was from the Tuscarora Eel Clan in Bertie Co. NC. My line of Barnes’ moved through Stokes Co. NC with the Barnes Castle Indians (aka Barneycastles), who eventually all settled in Washington State in the late 1800’s.
I think what is the most frustrating thing about this crazy “hobby” is many of us have Native American ancestry coming out of our ears, but we either connect to a dead tribe like me in Bertie Co., or we can’t quite find enough proof to link to a current tribe. I hope Haithcock’s research does not prove to be another disappointment for us.
Best Regards,
Four Cats
What Blackfoot Reservation in Randolf Co MO. I know nothing about this Rez. I know of the Kickapoos the Shawnees, Cherokees, Osages, Miamis, Missouris, Otoes, Sac n Faux, Delawares, ect..
Bob
Four Cats;34024 wrote: Hi Saj,
After finding the correct death certificate for John Barnes and running across a copy of the 1850 Dinwiddie County, VA Census, here is the correct line. I’ve found at least 14 John Barnes’ born between 1854-1856 in North Carolina and Virginia, which made this quite a challenge. Based on the number of Arthurs and Everetts in my line, I suspected this was the correct line for some time, but haven’t been able to put any documentation together to support this theory until now.
Naturally, I caution that my work below could contain some errors, so please be careful.
Before I close the door on the Stokes County Barnes’, I found that the Turbefield Barnes line originated with Jamestown immigrant, James Barnes who arrived in 1637. They moved through the Guilford/Stokes, NC area, and eventually settled in Nolansville, TN (http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com). Although they didn’t stay long, they sure tangled a few Barnes lines and make a Stokes County connection one of the toughest to prove. Something else about some of the Barnes’ in this area is that they combined their first names on the Census’. There was a Joab Barnes (February 27, 1812 – October 30, 1897), who was actually Joseph Abraham Barnes. The Sandford Barnes I was chasing is most likely Samuel S. Barnes, (1829 – February 08, 1863) who was born in Randolph County, NC, and moved to Stokes County, NC. He died during the Civil War, which likely explains the family mysteriously dropping off the map.
The revised Barnes line goes like this-
Generation A-
Father
John A. Barnes 1856 – January 06, 1915
Mother
Malissa (Creed) Barnes April 31, 1869 – ????
Children
Ida Barnes February 12, 1888 – ????
Mollie Barnes December, 1890 – ????
Martha Barnes February, 1892 – ????
Arthur Creed Barnes May 09, 1893 – August 07, 1949
Everett Burt Barnes March 17, 1897 – January 13, 1937
(Married Malissa Mitchell)
Nora Mae Barnes June 11, 1899 – ????
John Shade Barnes March 01, 1901 – March 10, 1957
Minnie Barnes 1902 – January 07, 1922
John Arthur Barnes, Jr. 1906 – ????
Tina Barnes 1908 – 19(??)
(1900 Tazewell County, VA Federal Census)
John and Malissa were also enumerated on the 1880 Federal Census in Norfolk, VA
Generation B-
Father
John R. Barnes 1823 – ????
Born in Virginia ?
Mother
Elizabeth (Unknown) Barnes 1825 – ????
Children
Martha A. Barnes 1850 – ????
John A. Barnes 1856 – ????
Married Malissa Creed
Joseph Barnes 1859 – ????
Susan Barnes 1859 – ????
William Barnes 1868 – ????
Winston Barnes 1870 – ????
All children born in VA
(1870 Dinwiddie, VA Federal Census)
Generation C-
This family will be familiar to some researchers-
Father
James Barnes 1793 – February 11, 1872
Born in Gates County, NC, died in Nansemond County, VA
Married Elizabeth Holland in April 04, 1818
Mother
Elizabeth (Holland) Barnes 1793 – ????
Married James Barnes on April 04, 1818
Children
William Everett Barnes November 20, 1820 – October 11, 1885
Born in Brunswick County, VA, and died in Nansemond County, VA
Married Pheraba Jane Council/Duck on 01/02/1843
John R. Barnes 1823 – ????
Born in VA
Buried in Barnes Cemetery on the East Side of Barnes Rd. in Suffolk, VA
“In Memory of James Barnes, Elizabeth Barnes, John R. Barnes (no dates)”
Dr. Thomas Holland Barnes May 28, 1831 – June 04, 1913
Born and died in Nansemond County, VA
Described as very tall
(1850 Isle of Wight County, VA Federal Census)
Generation D-
Father
Elias Barnes October 05, 1759 – ????
Married Rebecca Turner
Mother
Rebecca (Turner) Barnes ~ 1754 – 1830
Married Elias Barnes
Children
Unknown Female Barnes ~ 1790 – ????
Unknown Female Barnes ~ 1792 – ????
Sophia BARNES 1780 – 11 Apr 1878
Died in Platte, Missouri
Eleanor BARNES 1782 – ????
Catherine BARNES 1784 – ????
Fanny BARNES 1786 – ????
Elias BARNES, Jr. 1788 – ????
Unknown Female BARNES 1794 – ????
James Barnes 1793 – February 11, 1872
Born in Gates County, NC, died in Nansemond County, VA
Married Elizabeth Holland in April 04, 1818
Unknown Female BARNES 1798 – ????
All children born in North Carolina
(http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp)
This Barnes line continues back through Abraham Barnes’ Branch to Edward the Immigrant in Surry. This Turner connection has caught my eye, as they were moved from Hertford, NC to Randolph, MO, near the Blackfoot Reservation in Missouri.
The Turner line continues back into Pasquotank County, NC, so I’m curious as to what may turn up here.
One thing that supports some earlier Saponitown research posted by Michael Dunn is this line ties into the Wilson County Fiveash line via a later Fort marriage as well.
The current known connection-
James Barnes 1668 – March 02, 1718
Born in Isle of Wight County, VA, lived in Cypress Swamp in 1702
Mother
Sarah (Fiveash) Barnes 1650 – ????
Rumored to be from the Wilson County, NC Tuscarora Fiveash Family
Another recent surprise involved Lissie Mitchell, who married my G-Grandfather Everett Barnes. I hit a dead end with my Mitchell line last year, and I took a second look recently. These Mitchells did not come up out of North Carolina, but were pushed down into Tazewell, VA from the head of the Ohio River in PA.
Father
Thomas J. Mitchell 01/1863 – 1897
Born in VA
Father was “Ash-kah-puck-see” (1900 Kickapoo Census, Robert Mitchell)
Mother
Margarett (Unknown) Mitchell 10/1865 – ????
Born in VA
Children
William Harvy Mitchell 02/11/1882 – 12/11/1945
Born in Tazewell Co. VA
(1900 Tazewell, Maiden Springs, VA Federal Census)
This line of Mitchells appear to be displaced Ohio River Dhegiha-Siouans, and were sent to the Kaw Indian Reservations in Council Grove, Morris, KS and Miami, Ottawa County, OK. (http://www.kawnation.com/Culture/culthist.html)
Best Regards,
Four Cats
I am curious if the Haithcock book shows a reference or citation of the source of this data?
No reference or source that I have seen.
Am sure you already know that some folks changed from FPC/FC to something else from one census to the next. In that 1810 census of PCVA, Thomas Bowling is listed as FC. In 1811, he is listed as Indian. This was common among the Goinstown Indians and others, apparently. Hope that will be encouraging.
Hi Bob,
I had to think about this one a minute.
Elias Barnes, who moved to Missouri had a Depredation case on file with the BIA in the early 1800’s. I can’t put my hands on the info at the moment, but I believe he may have accused a neighboring “Blackfoot” tribe of destroying his crops or killing livestock.
I’m not sure if they were pushed west by the Indian Wars going on back east during this time, or mistaken for another tribe.
Best Regards,
Four Cats.
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