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Tess, do you have any contact info for them. I would love to get in touch with them to see if we are related. I’ll send you my e mail to give to them if you can.
Linda, My work email has been blocking anything we send to Yahoo lately. I saw that my mail failed. I’ll send it through my AOL account to see if it works.
Also, I these surnames again in case they ring a bell with someone:
Webb
Beaty
Forbes
Duke
Felton
Collier
Taylor
Here is some info I found related to the Lumbees. As my family was from Edgecombe County I thought it to be relevant.
<<Migration from Edgecomb/Granville Counties:
…Lawing discovered that in 1750 a cohesive social group of 25-40 families with some of the surnames now found in Robeson County was living in Edgecomb and Granville Counties, North Carolina. Most were listed on legal documents as mulattos, meaning one White and one nonwhite (either Black or Indian) parent. Thomas believes the cohesion in the groups was their considering themselves Indian. Since the area was a frontier in 1750, it was socially fluid, permitting racial intermarriages. Thomas believes the group was a concentration of refugee Indians from Virginia as well as areas to the east in North Carolina. The Indians were remnants of three small groups— the Yawpim and Potoskite of northeastern North Carolina and the Nansemond of Virginia. Before they lost their land and moved to the frontier region of Edgecomb and Granville Counties, NC, Thomas believe they intermarried a good deal with Whites and perhaps a smaller amount with Blacks and became fairly acculturated.>>
I know that some of you are Nansemond. I wonder if I might connect to any of those families, or Tuscarora. At this point I’m thinking my family was Saponi and Tuscarora, or some related tribe such as Nansemond.
Does anyone know if there is a database of surnames from these tribes at various times?
David,
Being half Lumbee, I’d be quite interested in reading the full article/chapter/??? mentioned in your citation. Could you please post your citation/source document. Thanks.
Roy
p.s.- Who is Lawing? … Thomas? What ARE some of the surnames common to both Edgecomb/Granville counties and Robeson county that Lawing discovered?
Sorry, I planned on posting the source, but missed it. I also had a title in there, but it was bold, and didn’t show up on the post.
The site discusses the possible origin of the Lumbees. The section I posted was subtitled “Migration from Edgecomb/Granville Counties.”
I left some of the details out because although they are interesting they were not relevant to the thread. Sorry.
It is interesting though that entire tribes– such as Lumbee and Haliwa, are not 100% sure of their origins (from the dominant society’s perspective and requirements). I hope that this is no indicator on how difficult if could be for my family.
Also on a side note: I know thw Waccamaw have these same questions of their origins. One theory is that they came from this area and are descendants of either the Saponi or Tuscarora, etc. They happen to have Webbs (who are NA) who originally came from the area my family is from.
http://www.lumbeetribe.com/Lumbee%20General%20Store/Graphics/More%20History.htm
David,
Thanks. I went to the web site you linked and realized that I’d seen this abstract many times over the last few years. This time, I decided to break down and buy a copy of the full report from the University of North Carolina Library at Chapel Hill. (In fact, I just get done ordering it. It was only $11.50.)
Once I receive and read it, if I discover anything relavent, or of interest to the forum, I’ll post it.
Roy
p.s.- The actual citation is below.
Thomas, Robert K. “A report on research of Lumbee origins.” Unpublished manuscript, 1976? 71 pages.
p.s.s.- For anyone who’s interested, you can purchase a photo-copy from the North Carolina Collection (at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill).
http://www.lib.unc.edu/ncc/copy.html
919-962-1172
Ask for Jill Wagy
David,
It is the same for me considering the Lumbees. I believe they are made up of our people. I have seen this same document you are referring too. I know some of my Etheridges headed that way as did some of my Rogers. I found one of my Etheridge lines in Indiantown the home of the Yawpin in Camden County. They moved to Nash County which was made from parts of Edgecombe County. Some more went to Robeson County. Apparently David the ones that stayed behind wanted to be known as white which is what happened to both of our families. They married heavily into the white population to the point today we are all known as white but many still claim that native ancestry. It is not forgotten except by a few families. The Lewis are an example of this they have completely forgotten. The Webb’s still remember as do the Rogers and Etheridges and the Moore’s. The Strickland’s remember too. As do the Wynne’s. I know this because I have relatives from all of these families. There is a gentleman is Conetoe, NC in Edgecombe County (he is a Webb) he has found 3 trunks full of arrowheads and hatchets there in the Conetoe area. This is were I grew up. My Uncle who passed last week was buried at the Wynne family farm just 8 miles from Conetoe. He married into the Wynne family and this family still claims native ancestry. I also descend from this family on my mother’s side (two lines of them actually). My father and uncle’s family were late into Edgecombe County and they are completely white but most of the 11 boys of that family married into mixed bloods including my own father:) It is very hard to prove native ancestry mostly you just have to believe what your family has told you. I think some of us just are born knowing the truth too which causes us to question the elders of our families about this. I think they also watch us as we grow up and see us for who we really are which is why some are told and some are not. My grandmother told all of us about her ancestry but my grandfather did not he was very selective. He never came right out and told me but he told me some things I thought were very odd and did not make sense until just recently. Nothing about that man made sense until just recently. I had typed much more here but felt it was not a good idea to let all of this known due to the climate and indian politics so I deleted it and will hold my counsel on issues surrounding my family. I hate politics. ugh what have I gotten us into?
Linda
Tess, did you ever contact the Monacan Webbs. If I’m correct the Monacans and Saponi were once connected, possibly synonymous. This could definitely be helpful. Thanks!
Also, to elaborate further on the Waccamaw connection: I mentioned previously that the Waccamaw-Siouan have a Webb family (one of their chiefs– James Webb) that trace their origins to the Edgecombe county area, and/ or VA. They believe that they were either Nansemond, Tuscarora, or possibly of Siouan stock such as Saponi. Their oral traditions indicate that 5 Webb brothers, descendants of a prominent chief traveled south to Green Swamp and joined them. There are also remanats of these Tuscs: The Southern Band of Tuscarora (they have 2 tribal offices in that area). My source of most of this infor comes from Chief James Webb’s nephew- Derrick, who has compiled a lot of evidence to support their theory.
I believe, as Linda does that our Webbs are Saponi, with possibly some Tuscarora blood. We all have the (Eastern) Blackfoot ID. I’d still like to find those connections!
David,
You have been quiet these last few days. I was hoping I had not upset you with that email last week. Although I have been thinking about something that might just work. I’ll email you later tonight with this idea.
Linda
David I apologize that I have not gotten back in touch with you until now. I only have Internet access at work.
I did not contact the Charlottesville, VA Webb’s. I went there on a mission and didn’t have time for much of anything else. 7-8 hr. drive there, do my stuff, drive 7-8 hrs. back to SC…sorry…
Linda, I’ve actually been contemplating your last email over the last few days. I’ve also been very busy, so I thought I would wait to reply until I could take the time. I look forward to your email. I had some ideas too.
Tess, thats fine. Maybe there is another way we can contact them? I appreciate the thought.
— Thanks
Bill, do we know any more about John Duke, father of Teresa (DOB; POB, etc)? Also, it looks like John Webb Sr is my earliest Webb. Do you see anyone before him? Do we know the parents of Beatrice Beaty and Arthur Forbes and where they came from? Their Granddaughter Addie Was supposedly a full blood. How was Addie Webb related to her husband Kinyard? They were supposedly cousins, but I don’t see the connection. Thanks!
I have no further, provable data on John Webb Sr, nor on the Forbes and Dukes.
Christiana’s father David Webb Sr is related in some fashion to Joseph R. Webb’s father Bennett Webb but I didn’t find anything sepcific enough to prove how Kinyard and Addie were related.
Bill
Thanks for everything Bill. Do you know if ther is anything further on the Taylor Line? You wrote:
<<>>
Linda Carter mentioned that she was told Taylor could be a Saponi name.
Thanks again.
Linda, here is some info that Derrick (Waccamaw) gave me. It looks like our Webbs were in Northampton at the same time…. Derrick thinks (and I agree) that records from two reservations there might hold some clues. Do you know of anyone who might have more info on this?
<<<"Bertie county became Northampton Co. (or vise versa). But Berite was large and included part of Southampton co VA. The VA/NC line back then as is today Northampton NC, and Southampton VA.
In the early 1700’s two indian reservations were established. one called Indianwoods reservation and the other called Southampton Reservation. After the Indian wars several different tribes were thrown on these reservations (after wars of 1711-1715). These would be all of the tribe in that NC/VA area. So we’re talking about different tribes, nonrelated all placed on same reservations.
I have a document from the Tus tribe in Berti co of many of the Indians who were on the Indian Woods reservation. Mostly the names of chiefs. Many of these chiefs left the reservation and migrated to my neck of the woods (Waccamaw country). This includes Mitchell, Lowey, Bravboy, Skipper and a few others. But we know from early Webb deed in Waccamaw country that they came too. But questions is from where. They are not listed in the Indian woods reservation records. But perhaps are listed in the Southampton co reservation, where I understand is where the Nottoway and Nasmond indians were placed.”>>>
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