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Here is the timeline for the Jesse BROCK line. Jesse married Rebecca Howard: Here is what it says on the Brock Research Site:
Children of Jesse Brock source information:
In Elijah Brock Testimony given personally to Annie Walker Burns. Elijah Brock states ” Jesse Brock was the first settler on Wallins Creek, Kentucky. He was about three-quarter indian, and had so much indian blood in him, that he had no trouble in living among the indians who were thickly settled in the mountains when he first came, raised his family among them, hunted along with them, with no trouble whatever. He homesteaded where Parks Howard lives at this time.”
About everything I have read says Jesse was the son of Aaron Brock but I have not been able to document this. Can anybody view the information below and let me know if anything rings a bell?
Documented Timeline:
1776: Jesse Brock listed as member of Matrimony Creek Baptist, Rockingham Co.,
NC (Rockingham Co. formed from Guilford Co.)
Source: http://ftp.rootsweb.com/pub/usgenweb/nc/rockingham/church/rockchr.txt
1781 Enlisted at Surry Co., NC for the third time.
Source: KY Microfilm Series M-804, Roll 347 Note: I have not see this personally as of yet.
1795 Russell Co., VA Tax List
Source: http://www.rootsweb.com/~varussel/census/1795tx.html
1796 Russell Co., VA Tax List
Source: http://www.rootsweb.com/~varussel/census/1796tx.html
1797 Russell Co., VA Tax List
Source: http://www.rootsweb.com/~varussel/census/1797tx.html
1798 Russell Co., VA Tax List
Source:http://www.rootsweb.com/~varussel/census/1798tx.html
1799 Franklin Co., VA Personal Property Tax List
Source: http://freepages.misc.rootsweb.com/~vataxlists/Franklin/1799PersonalA/02.jpg
1801 – 1809 Knox Co., KY Tax List
Source: http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyknox/
1810 Census Knox Co., KY
Source: http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/ky/knox/census/1810/84.jpg
1819 – Listed among residents of Knox being transferred to Harlan Co.
Source: http://www.rootsweb.com/~seky/datafile/1819list.html
1820 Census Harlan Co., KY National Archives Series M33 Roll 23, Part 1, Page 102
1822 – Land Grant Harlan Co. Source: THE KENTUCKY LAND GRANTS Volume 1 Part 1 CHAPTER
VI KENTUCKY LAND WARRANTS (1816-1873) THE COUNTIES OF KENTUCKY page 487
http://www.geocities.com/brockresearch/landgrants
1822 – Deeds: Jesse BROCK Sr. to Amon BROCK, Feb. 5, 1822 for $100. 30 acr.
the N. side of the Cumberland River, opposite the mouth of Wallins Crk.
Source: ftp://ftp.rootsweb.com/pub/usgenweb/ky/harlan/court/deeds/deedabs.txt
1823 – Land Grant Harlan Co. Source: THE KENTUCKY LAND GRANTS Volume 1 Part 1 CHAPTER III
OLD KENTUCKY GRANTS (1793-1856) THE COUNTIES OF KENTUCKY page 153
http://www.geocities/brockresearch/landgrants
1824 – Deeds: Jesse BROCK Sr. to Aaron BROCK Oct. 25, 1824 for $100. 60
acr. on Wallens Creek, part of Jesse BROCK’s original survey.
Witness: Elijah GREEN, Terry MELTON, Larkin HOWARD.
Source: ftp://ftp.rootsweb.com/pub/usgenweb/ky/harlan/court/deeds/deedpt3.txt
1833 Pension Application
Source: KY Microfilm Series M-804, Roll 347 Note: I have not see this personally as of yet.
1840 – Census Harlan Co., KY National Archives Series M704 Roll 113, Page 113
That’s very interesting testimony, Brenda, especially considering it was about a state that “had no Indians.”
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~brockfamily/ChiefRedBird.html
here’s another webpage it says —
“Chief Red Bird is believed to be Aaron Brock, Sr. (born ca 8 Dec 1721 in VA, died 1811 in Clay Co., KY). Descendants of Aaron’s son Jesse Brock show DNA evidence of Cherokee ancestry.”
DNA evidence however can not prove tribal affiliation, but it might provide Indian ancestry if you are descended from a male descended from a male et cetera or from a female descended from a female all the way to an Indian ancester. I think the author probably meant to say “Indian ancestry” not “Cherokee ancestry.”
vance
http://www.rootsweb.com/~varussel/census/1796tx.html
Above lists Samuel Richey also married a girl surnamed Howard.
http://www.rootsweb.com/~varussel/census/1796tx.html
It mentions Samuel Richey again. It also mentions Haril Wayland. I bet that should be “Nevil” Wayland and that they transcribed it wrong. He’s another ancestor of mine.
http://www.rootsweb.com/~varussel/census/1798tx.html
Brock, George (1)
Brock, James (1)
Brock, Jesse (1)
Didn’t you say one of them married a Howard girl? That’s interesting. I can not tie this “Samuel Richey” to my Richey’s. My g-g-g-grandpa was born in 1797 in Virginia, and I am wondering if Samuel was his father. I have run across his name before.
It also lists the Richey and 3 Waylands this time, Henry, William and Nevil. We are descended from a William who was the son of Nevil, but William also had a brother named Nevil. I am thinking this William is probably an Uncle of the one I am descended from, but I am not sure.
All the census records have a”John Woods” and we are also descended from a John Woods. Now if the Dickson name would show up I’d have all 4 of my g-g-grandpa’s grandparents names listed.
I was wrong about Samuiel Richey marrying a Howard girl, it was a Porter and later a Kendrick girl, he had 2 wives.
I have seen that Howard surname somewhere else tho . . .
also
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~brockfamily/ChiefRedBird.html
here is a map and of the general area I suppose they say “Red Bird” was, whom they think was a Brock. Off to teh right in Floyd County, in the left edge of the county, is a place called “Wayland”.
vance
Linda and Vance:
There is some very interesting reading on this link about the early Kentucky.
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~brockfamily/ChiefRedBird-byKBTankersley.html
I have to note here that I have heard many negitive remarks about this site because they feel this man is promoting his book but if he has proof of what he has written then there is some very important information within.
Like most Kentucky Cherokee Chiefs, Red Bird (Totsu’hwa) was a Chickamaugan. His village was known as Taluegue (a local variation of the eastern word Telliqua and western Tahlequah), located near the present town of Fogertown, Clay County, Kentucky, along the Warrior’s Path, also known as the War Trail. The Warrior’s Path ran up Goose Creek to the mouth of Otter Creek, up Otter Creek, and down Stinking Creek.
Vance, you seen how close on that map Floyd County was. My Meredith Collins along with his son Bradley Collins were listed on Floyd Co. Ky records as Mullato and free persons of color. Crystal and I discussed several times that she felt there were several Indian villages along the Big Sandy Valley on the border between Kentucky and West Virginia. I also found a map that outlines a Indian village on the border of Kentucky and Tennessee and how many times have we heard there were NO INDIANS IN KENTUCKY. If this was so then who did Daniel Boone tangle with when he went over the Cumberland Gap?
Howdy Brenda,
You asked about other Indians in the area. I’m sure you already know this, but I am just gonna speculate a little.
Standard history says Dragging Canoe was upset over a treaty and that Chickamaugan Warriors from South East Tennessee came north and fought with settlers in their fort like settlements.
But we also hear of Shawnee Chief Logan and somebody here mentioned a Delaware Chief Bull who emigrated to this area but I forget what timeframe he was here. And then there are the “friendly Indians that came with the first settlers wo helped build Fort Blackmore, according to Lewis M. Jarvis.
Since this “Brock” was near my Waylands, and I showed where a Gibson lived on the same property as those Waylands. Also there was a neighbor named Gibson. Gibson is a well known Melungeon name. If Mr. Tankersley can prove his Brock’s were Cherokee, what does that say about Melungeon’s who must have been his neighbors? Were they Chickamauga/Cherokee who didn’t agree with Dragging Canoe’s war, then, and fled to help the settlers, just like Nancy Ward did? Well it has been shown I think these people came from this area called “The Piedmont” (I still don’t know what “the Piedmont” is 🙂 — is it mountains, hills, coastal woodland plain, river valleys, eastern prairie . . . ). Haven’t yall shown these Melungeon surnames coming from here? So since this “Brock” was a revolutionary War veteran, maybe he was an Eastrern Indian and not a Cherokee from west of the mountains. My elder Nevil Wayland was also a Veteran of the Revolutionary War.
I am becoming more and more convinced some people called themselves “Cherokee” and maybe they were from an extinct or nearly extinct tribe, or a tribe that had to run for their lives and fled off in different directions. Or perhaps the Lowland Cherokee who were wiped out, those in SC and East Georgia. Some people say they were all killed off. Maybe they fled into the woods and became these people since there is a strong connection from their descendants to be identified as Cherokee. Maybe they were escaped Indian slaves/ I think I read early excerpts dsayin’ Indians didn’t make good slaves because they just fled into the woods if they got a chance. Maybe that’s who we are descended from.
Sorry for all the speculating. I want to fit everything into a “nice, neat package” but all I can do is “guess” at hte origin of our ancestors.
About the Big Sandy, I remember reading those posts. I am wondering if Brock’s village called somethin like “Tahlequah” might be a Tutero Village. Weren’t the “Tutero” the people who lived in this area? This is very interesting.
vance
Vance: I have been in contact with a friend who’s sister-in-law is from the Chickamaugan tribe. She is really into tribal history and as soon as I hear from her I will post what she has to say.
I think “The Piedmont” of Virginia is actually the heart of the early settlement. I could also be wrong.
The COLLINS and GIBSON’s were both Melungeon surnames. Two of the most common names and found living near each other in Virginia and North Carolina before Newman’s Ridge in Tennessee. It appears if you find a Collins family you can almost be sure to find a Gibson living near by. The well known Melungeon ,Vardy Collins, was living on land adjoining Meredith Collins in Wilkes Co. NC in 1797. Meredith moved into what was Russell co. Virginia and Vardy went to Newman’s Ridge in Tennessee but if you look at a map they were just a few miles from each other. Meredith was listed in the records of Russell County, Va from 1799-1809 and was listed in Floyd Co. Ky by 1810.Vardy’s brother, Valentine Collins, then moved to Floyd Co. Ky. and lived a short distance from Meredith. Vardy and Valentine were brothers, the sons of Samuel Collins, son of Old Thomas Collins of Flatt River. Living close to old Thomas on the Flatt River was a family of GIBSON’s. My belief is that Vardy and Valentine were first cousins of Meredith. For many years I thought they could have been brothers and they still well might be but I have no proof. I do know they knew each other and the family is connected in some way. According to JARVIS The Collins and Gibson’s comming to Newman’s Ridge were “Living in Virginia as friendly Indians”.
Vance:
Chief Logan was a Mingo who lived in PA and Maryland, I believe (I am not sure where he ended up after the Northwestern Tribes ended their fighting. I am thinking Canada, but I am sitting in my office and my sources are not here.). I have read conflicting reports of who the Mingo were. Some say Seneca (Iroquois) while some say that they were a mixture of Indians from different tribes who were hired as mercenaries, because they were good fighters. Logan was Cayuga, (if I am not having a “senior moment”) who was friendly until renegade whites killed his family. He then sought revenge and attacked settlers in PA, Maryland, Ohio and Kentucky, I believe.
I think I have more information on Chief Bull if you are interested back at home too. He also fought in the Northwestern wars during the PA, Kentucky, and Ohio settlement.
Cindy
In 1747 Logan’s mother died in Shamokin of a disease that spread through there. Logan’s father, Shickellamy, shortly thereafter married a Tutelo woman. He then died Dec. 12, 1748. She then remarried and is noted passing through Shamokin with her new husband on March 20, 1749. This is from the Moravian Archives.
Logan was already a grown man during that time. As to his raid, it also went through the Big Sandy area in WV. Mingo county is named after him, and there’s a monument to him, which I thought fairly odd, seeing as how he’d led a massacre through there. He died at home, I believe, killed by a family member. I want to say he was still in Ohio. It’s said he was pretty far gone with alcoholism at that point.
The general feeling amongst the present day Mingo descendants is that they are an amalgam of tribes at one point tributary to the League, or part of it, who did not remain with it, but settled away from reservations, usually in mountain backcountry and slipped out of sight. Their dialect of Seneca was still being spoken in WV in the 50’s. Thomas McElwain is the informant for the linguistic preservation that was done by Jordan Lachler and is accessible at http://www.speech.cs.cmu.edu/egads/mingo/
There’s a Mingo e-list I’m on with language study and great conversation at http://www.speech.cs.cmu.edu/egads/mingo/mingo-l.html
There’s been a lot of discussion about him on the e-list, which I believe can be accessed in their archives. http://list.unm.edu/archives/mingo-l.html
Thomas McElwain wrote about him in Barbara Mann’s “Native American Speakers of the Eastern Woodlands” which is in most university stacks. I highly recommend it. His piece is Chapter 4 “Then I Thought I Must Kill Too.” Logan’s Lament, a Mingo Perspective. He debunks a lot of the mythology that grew up around Logan, as he was heavily romanticized in the 19th century.
I LOVED what Barbara did with the Kandiaronk chapter, “‘Are you delusional?’: Kandarionk on Christianity”. Kandariank is the “Adario” whose conversation was recorded by Baron de Lahanton in the early 1700s, which was heavily drawn upon by French Enlightnment propagandists. I wrote a thread on that in here somehwere.
Thanks.Linda. I will check out these resources when I have time. Logan had a home, hunting lodge or something not far from where my gggrandmother (with the Blackfoot ID) was supposed to have been born.
Cindy
Interesting, that places a Blackfoot ID’d family near a known Tutelo location. Was that near Shamokin?
Linda:
No, it is in Beaver County, PA. on the west side near Pittsburgh. My ggggrandfather built the first school in Slippery Rock (I have to think that he and my ggggrandmother came to Iowa because of her ethnicity, but I have no proof. They came a decade after the Shawnee families that her children married into who obviously left because of the Trail of Tears. I have always wondered if it had something to do with the fact that Iowa had a Half-Breed Tract. They lived fairly close to it.) Bess already placed the Tutelo in this location in her research. She posted it here before. I thought I had found it on a web site too, but I can’t find it right now and I just got a new computer, so I don’t have my old bookmarks.
Did you know that the Shawnee had a chief (?) or warrior called Tutelu?
Cindy
Hello Brenda,
I am from the Griffin Collins line, isn’t there some who think that Meredith and Griffin were brothers? Didn’t an Ambrose Collins fit in there somewhere? I have been reading this forum’s posting and trying to remember the connections. Anyway, my Collins’s oral history always referred to that side as Cherokee Indian, and as you are aware they were listed as FPC on early census records. They finally settled in Wise CO., VA and Letcher CO., KY. But we did have Collins’s marrying Gibson’s also, both known Melungeon surnames! Just trying to get it straight.
Nancy
Nancy,
In 1821 Meredith’s son John W. Collins SR. married a woman in Grainger Co. TN by the name of Lydia Toner/Stoner. That record was found in the University of Tennessee Archives . John W. was noted to be in Meredith’s household up until 1820. That 1821 marriage record showed Griffin Collins as bondsman. I believe they were related , possibly brothers. John W. (1838) later showes up in Pike Co. Ky court records as one of four sons accused by Meredith of stealing his land. First wife Lydia died abt 1848-50 and he met up with Mary Roark in Clay co. Ky. Mary Roark is descended from the BROCK line.
Meredith’s second wife ,Mary HOLLOWAY, disappears from records about 1812 and by 1815 Meredith has a new common law ife and a son Levi Johnson Collins. The common law wife was Millie Johnson, supposely full blood Cherokee.
Yes I knew all of these Collins were listed as either Mullato or free person of color.I believe they were mixed blood Indians.
Brenda
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